#429: How To Get Hot On Cold Calls w/ Chris Beall

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

talk, people, podcast, world, sales, sell, seconds, marketing, started, chris, seattle, numbers, meeting, buy, call, trust, market, business, digital, b2b

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We're recording. We're going, where's the music? I just hit the record because we were dicking around. That was fun. Okay, are you ready? Yeah.

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Sweat equity podcast.

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The number one business comedy, comedy podcast, business comedy, comedy, Business Business comedy podcast, world. Money more. Cool, dude, we're number one. Not anymore. Not after that intro. Dude are our homie Chris Beal out of Seattle. He's dropping a lot of psychology ops on us. A lot of what was called Tactical empathy. Yes. Wait, he did that to us. Oh, he totally did it. I didn't even know dude, we were like, Let's go be friends with him. Let's go fly to Seattle. Listen to us on Apple podcast app, Spotify, Amazon. Podcasts, Amazon music, Google podcasts. I Heart Radio I heart podcast. We're on everything man. You know how to do

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this episode was good. All our all our sponsors are in Episode description. And I'm gonna reel right through Squarespace. Build a website. Oh,

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yeah, I need to apologize to my kids throughout this entire episode actually maniacs come through call rail call tracking. You want to track all the calls on your website. Get them all recorded. Chris. Chris by has better technology. But if you're like us, you can do call rail call tracking. It's good for your marketing and LinkedIn premium two months free. See what creepy people are looking at your profiles? Yeah. Did you see that? You're the creep. You see the guy that hit me up an InMail? Is Jeff Epstein. Yes. So you couldn't just let that go? No, I was like, That guy who got tough life. And if you want to be your BFF subscribe to the Padres five stars, write a review, share the show. Let's get it started with some b2b sales talk

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on it, sweat equity.

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Listening to the sweat equity podcast.

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Hey, hey, hey, sir.

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All right. What are we? What are we sweating in equities? And today? That's what I want to know. Talking some b2b sales strategies. Sounds like I have heard. I don't I don't believe in him. Either B sales doesn't go, that doesn't happen. Well, I'm gonna I'm gonna come back to that circle back around to that we're going by the way we just I don't know if you got to listen to any episodes before coming on here. But you seem like a pretty busy big time. Deal kind of guy.

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I'm a I'm a sad sack who goes into spreadsheets? And then yeah, upset people. And then somebody answers. What was that? Yeah. Well, we appreciate that. There's a certain type like that spreadsheet every once in a while. Yeah, Andy. But I don't know. Anyway, yeah. What are we going to talk about? We're going to recording and

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what we try to do upfront is let everybody know, we let you do the plugs. We let the guests do the plugs. Instead of me trying to read them incorrectly out loud. It's really better that way.

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So where can people find you?

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What's that? I don't even have any plugs. But I'll say something you want me to say like who I am? What we do, and then we move on? We've we're not editing any of this out.

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So we're going Yeah, so we're live on tape roll, baby. Yeah. You're live. Excellent. Connecting cell.com is one of them. Right? Yeah. Connect and sell. That's it. Yep. And you had a podcast, I was looking for market dominance, guys. market dominance, guys. So I think we're gonna record episode 197 Immediately after this. Well, man, we don't want to get into a pissing contest with you. But you know, this is for 29 Most people don't get that far. You're for real. We were totally accidental. And I still don't want to do any more.

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rocket sled. It takes off. You can't stop it. Yeah, no, most people don't get past 20 or so. I'm going to do a podcast and they run out of stuff to talk about. Yeah.

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Well, we are gonna want to write a book and it turned into a podcast. Yeah, we're we've been playing around with the idea of taking these interviews and then putting in first book, just just so we can drop that hammer in a social situation to go. You read my book, right? Or an introduction.

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I checked GPT read a book out of the first 25 episodes of our podcast.

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And we got rave reviews on Amazon. Somebody called it a cheap cash grab, which I thought was excellent. I wish that were true. Yeah, I mean, the podcast like those be like cheap cash grabs. Yeah. The podcast game. It's a long game, right? It's not you got to do it. The ones that are over produced right out of the gate, you know, they never, they're never really good. And you see a lot of, you're seeing a lot more actors

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to podcast, strike and say,

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I didn't know that was going on. That's pretty good. Let's do a raw cast. Yeah.

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This is raw dog cast. When he says

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we ask everybody who comes on the first time on sweat equity. We'd like to ask everybody this question. What advice would you give your 13 year old self?

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Oh, okay. Yeah, you just thought were tank tops and sunglasses? Yeah, I've got one deep question we asked a year old So my advice would be don't fall down a mountain when you're 14. But

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I'm gonna

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read that story, please.

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It's a good one. Up in Mount Rainier, where are we talking? Are you Seattle born I felt that Sierra Nevada was 14 killed about 800 feet. Whoa.

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Hold on the mountain. But make sure you live. I did live, but it was by an accident. You know, it's like, It wasn't intentional.

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Man was does that give you the energy to live life to the fullest ever since then?

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It does feel like a freebie.

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So maybe, you know, like, if you don't tell your 13 year old self about that you got a lifetime?

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See, that's such a great podcast.

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1227? Well, we want to you know, it's a question that kind of it's a leading question of sorts, because it'll tell us a little bit about your upbringing. What did you I guess? A little bit of venturous it seems like mountain climbing family, you know, pretty young to be on a any kind of to be put in that position? Yeah.

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put myself in that position. That was even a

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word you grew up.

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I grew up in the desert north of Scottsdale.

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No, no people to speak of, or older sisters. They might have cannabis people. One of them is Shelley Morrison who works my podcast. So okay, she's person and a lot of hamster books. And so I was kind of raised by animals and books and occasional human to talk.

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I don't know, I look, I always say I have two older sisters. I can't imagine for be I don't know, I'd probably be like schizophrenic. But I do look at it as a a. I am very grateful to have two older sisters now because it's like I have I have platonic friend female friends that a lot of guys can't really do that. You know, and I can sit right there. I can say yeah, a bunch, including my wife.

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She's actually she's actually a friend. It's not platonic. But it's like, we can sit around and talk shop, we can talk personal stuff. We can do all that stuff. And I think it's because I was raised by women. How long have you been married for

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this particular? My. So I was married twice before my second wife passed away suddenly in June of 2019. Out of the blue, no, no disease or anything that we knew about. And I've been married now, Helen, and I've been married since July two of last year. So we went on a nice nine week honeymoon. And when I met her she was carrying a $5 billion plus quota for Microsoft. Well, now she's gone on to bigger things. We're talking high high socialite atmosphere Seattle here and we're talking what's what is it telling him? What is it across the across the way? Where are you?

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Bragging almost, we're almost on an island. We're kind of near the beach where people drive you know, loud, fast, low riders up and down and occasional shootings and we don't participate in the shootings. We watch them. Wait, I'm sorry. Eric was babbling. Where did you say you are now? We're in West Seattle. Okay, okay. We're looking at Babel out over the water to to the mountains. We also have a house up in Port Townsend, Washington, which is at the end of the peninsula over on the other side of the water. And then we have another house down in southern Arizona and Green Valley. Not too shabby Chris not too shabby at all. Let's list our house. We're old and we work hard. That's great. That's That's good to hear. In Seattle is one of my favorite cities in the country. Been there about a dozen times. It's

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a

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I've performed at giggles if you remember that near U DUB.

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The comedy club that was a strip club that went back to a comedy club. giggles The Wiggles? Yeah, yeah, that's where some guys waited for me outside. And I had to hide in the kitchen until the cops came. It was cool. It was a cool, cool comedy rattle. But you gotta make the go eat dicks. Because there's a dick's burger place in Seattle? You know? Yeah, those kinds of things.

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Chris,

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you know, there's a lot, there's a lot to pick, like, your Booker sent us over some things to go through. But I kind of like, I want to see what's on your mind lately in the, your CEO.

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You know, you're in the sales and selling kind of

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strategy and guidance. Is that fair to say?

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Well, actually, what we do is we provide a technology to let somebody wants to talk to people in sales, like, you know, people that they don't know, let them push a button and talk to somebody on their list in about three minutes with no effort. So we've been doing it for 17 years. And it's one of a kind, it mixes AI and human beings working together. So that careful calls the same time and you get connected to the target who actually answers it's pretty magical. You go from talking to three, four people a day to talking to 3040 50 if you want so it's not humans with AI implants are? No, I'm not there yet. Right? Neuro link. Alright, we gotta get on Chris's good side, if he's in an RV of nobody is. So you. Instead of pursuit of happiness, that movie, we're Will Smith dialing numbers, like doesn't leave, he has a strategy for pushing the numbers on the phone in the 70s or whatever. You've now you haven't phone auto dialer kind of system that's AI driven.

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Yeah, that's both AI and human driven. Because sometimes you have to talk to a gatekeeper. And you have to handle all those weird phone trees and all that stuff out there. So it does everything, it'll call any number. And he you know, you give it a list of 1000 people, 100 people, 10 people, whatever. And it knows their best phone number to so it knows which phone number they answer on and make sure that it calls that one instead of that one you provided if you know if that's smart thing to do. But it's just as simple. Have you load the list? You say? I want to talk to somebody push the green sell button and you talk to somebody? So it sounds like you're more on? You know, and this is one of the bullet points, we got the data to find the numbers. Are you more on that side then really a super duper, you know, kind of sales center kind of guy?

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Well, it's more. For me personally, I actually come out of the software world. I've been building software since 1968. And that's a while ago. So right before it was like way easier back then.

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It was it was hard. Okay, a lot of interesting. Why is why was it harder? I'm curious. It was harder because you didn't have all those subsystems to do anything for you. Now you kind of you can do no code stuff now. And it does something. No code back. And if you want to debug and you were like reading core dumps, you know, I'd go home sometimes the stack of paper, seven inches high. Okay, yeah, that's a good point with a ruler and flip it over and over looking for a pattern and the hexadecimal numbers. Totally. Yeah, we did. We did that for fun. When we grew up with CML code. We've definitely been there. Yeah, less. Like, it's all the same idea where it's like, one little thing is off, where is it? Gonna find it? deductive logic? Well, it's, you know, the digital world is naturally fragile. I've ended. It's the tiniest thing that breaks it, you know, the analog world where we live with our 50 trillion human cells in our body, you can screw that up pretty bad. You know? Yeah, you can get up in the morning, you can hit your head, you can stub your toe, you can cut your finger. It'd be alright. You do any of that to a digital system. It's broken. And it's not coming back.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, I mean, tell us about that kind of market intelligence is more of the competitive advantage for you all.

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Well, for us, the way we look at the world is this First of all, in business to business, everybody scared to death to buy. They don't want to recommend anything because their careers on the line. So here's my comparison, if I buy a Tesla, right, so I go buy the new Tesla. I don't have one now. I bring it home. I drive it around. And you know, I get this weird symptom of sitting in the Tesla and like, my ass starts to itch, right? That's like, what's that all about? So after a few days, I go to the doctor. He goes, Hey, Chris, sorry, you know, you gotta get rid of the Tesla. You're allergic to electricity. Go allergic to electricity. Yeah, okay. Get rid of it. Right. Well, what am I out? Maybe 510 $1,000 I'm gonna make that back. I buy that same $70,000 thing for Mike.

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company, I don't care who I am, I can be the CEO. And it makes the company's assets. It doesn't fit in. It doesn't work. That's That's my career. That's my kids college education. That's my retirement. So people in b2b are scared to buy. That's very hard to make a decision. Yeah. That's self preservation for their own career. Yeah, exactly, exactly. And so creates problem, which is you got to sell to people you don't know, you can't just sell to people you do now. And you've got to get them to trust you appropriately, by the way, because you're actually trying to help them. And the question is, how do you do that? And that's what we focus on. First and foremost is, look, we're going to connect you to somebody and it's going to be an ambush. Now, what now? Well, so we actually teach folks how to turn that other person's fear into trust and seven seconds, which is all the FBI says we have, we don't have eight, we only have seven. And then how to turn that trust into curiosity and curiosity and commitment. So they'll actually attend a meeting and you can talk to them about what it is you do and what they might need, right. So we think the whole world of the b2b economy, the innovation economy is stuck behind that one thing which is getting another human being to trust you. And to do it in the time you have to do it, which is only seven seconds. What's Yeah, what's the seconds is a rodeo thing. That's eight seconds. That's a Chris Voss thing. So Chris Voss, he wrote that book never split the difference. Everybody knows Chris Voss, I bought that and haven't read it.

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Listen, it's worth listening to it's actually it's a better listen than to read. And I was at dinner one night, at a an event. And Chris was there at the table. I was fortunate enough to be set, same table as him. And I kind of approached him afterwards said, Hey, how long do we have to get processed and a cold call? Because I figured FBI hostage negotiator starts with a cold call.

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Gotta call the hostage taker. First time meeting him, Oh, how they must have studied this. And he just looked at me. He goes, seven seconds. I said, really, because our research says eight seconds. You said your research is wrong. seconds.

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Cool. Well, so we have to do that seven second, that is a little flustered. Because that's easy. All we have to do is show that other person that we see the world through their eyes, we call it tactical empathy. And then we need to demonstrate to them that we are competent to solve a problem they have right now. I said, Well, isn't the problem they have right now me? And he said, Yeah, that's why you can't fail. You hold the keys to solving the problem. That's you. You can just make a deal with

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that. Yeah, that's very this. My mind is racing right now. Okay, how do I use my life? Man, we should have done shrooms before. This. No, no, no, we wouldn't make you know, I wouldn't even be paying attention. I'd be like, oh, man, I gotta go think about my life for a little bit. That was like kind of psycho psychological and philosophical at the same time.

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Yeah, so it's like your, your the self fulfilling prophecy solution to the own problem you created.

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And you have to get that. It reminds me when I took Groundlings school improv classes, they're like, You got to do like, 10 things before the lights get up. And you got like, maybe seven seconds, something like that. And it's like, wait, I have to figure out the character. I have to have some space work where it looks like visibly, your time's up. While you're asking questions. I have to have a relationship with the other person on stage. So I have to go Dad, what do you you know, I can't ask a question. I gotta go. You can't fart in my sweatpants anymore. You know, something like that. We have to be in a setting, you know, Target, you have to figure like all those things like that, right? Eventually, you get good at it. So I believe you can hone this skill. I'm very interested in the Delta have that one second difference that flustered you because you're like, we got it down to eight, your

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seven bitch. What is happening in this one second hand was slow. Yeah, it could have been anything, seems it's negligible or resources, right? They know how to study this thing. It's more important to them that we're saving lives. We're just trying to, you know, call call somebody get a meeting. But we're, it's turned out to be the key to our whole business. So we've been doing this thing for 17 years, we push a button to talk to somebody, no effort fast. But what we found was, everything came down to the skill and the will of the person holding the conversation. And we'd never expected that. Well, we thought as the ecosystem will take care of it. You know, there's trainers out there, they'll train them. Well, one of the top trainers in the world once called me up one of the top cold call trainers. He said, Chris, your customer XYZ can't say who it is. He says I just did the s bootcamp with the best ever with those guys. And he told me how great it was right?

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So I looked at their numbers on a Friday, because I got all their numbers, they were doing 30,000 dials a day, setting about 65 meetings, I looked at their numbers on Monday, no difference. So that kind of thing started to wake me up to you know what we've got the means, because we can listen to all these conversations, we can deliver them fast, so you can coach them. I mean, imagine you're trying to learn something, I don't know what you're trying to learn gospel, you could swing the club twice a day. And the coach shows up at the end of the week and goes, I don't know, I think I don't like your grip. You're not gonna get any better. Coaches gotta be there on every swing and start from the beginning with not like your grip, your stance or your attitude, or whatever. And worked with you a little bit of a time so you can get all the way through it. It's like improv. Right? You get out there the first time. You're not very good, probably because those seven things and some other stuff, right? You got to get towards ballistic and you have to be coached through it. So that's why we started this thing called Flight School, where we teach folks how to get the call off the ground, fly it towards its destination, deal with all the turbulence all the special objections that come up in a cold call, like, Hey, we're all set. Everybody's favorite, right? No, you're not? Yes, you are, though you are on the third grade playground. And then how do you land that meeting? So we we do that and we do it live fire. People make money doing it. It's not like going out for training, like some training class. It's live fire, you're really selling, you're doing it. And you get coached on every conversation. It's so precise. We coach folks for the first two hours, on the first seven seconds of the conversation. What can you immediate bullet points on that? Is it scripted? And I mean, seven seconds, how much could you learn about this other person in seven seconds even have a reaction to something you know, and I but this is your gimmick. So we'll hear from you. I'm just trying to figure this out as we go. Yeah. Do you have to apologize? Like when I last seven seconds in bed go up? Sorry. Sorry, you're so hot. Sorry. Very similar. You gotta throw yourself under the bed. Like,

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you look so hard tonight. Sorry.

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It's not that apology, but it's very close. So you do have to, you have to show them that you see the world through their eyes. So what we teach people to say, there's a lot of ways to do this. We teach people something that's easy to learn, which is just to say, I know I'm an interruption. Not like, oh, I believe I might be interrupting your day, none of this, putting it off on your day or any of this. It's like, I know, I am a bad thing. I am an interruption. Because that's how you see the world. Then you change your voice and you change it to a voice the FBI calls playful, curious. It means come along with me, we're going somewhere fun. And you show him your question, which is you can go away, and then just ask a simple question. It's a question of fact, actually, kind of 27 seconds tell you why call. And if you say that just right, those two things, which only takes about five seconds, then most people will say,

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Sure, or you got 17 seconds or whatever. That's the first time you learn something about it. It's how they respond to that question about the 27 seconds. Now almost everybody calls this a permission based opener. It's not. It's not at all. It's a trust building. The purpose is to build trust, through an involuntary reaction inside somebody else's brain way down in their midbrain, where they're going to hear this and go. Sure, go ahead. Now you got a problem. Of course, you got to go ahead. Right. But at least you got that far. You got from fear because they're afraid of you. They're afraid of you because you're an invisible stranger. I mean, think about that place you used to work, right?

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You step out back, there's a dark, invisible stranger is a problem. You let the lights on. See what's going on? Well, you can't turn the lights on on a telephone at person ambushes you you, you're in the grip of an invisible stranger. Your heart rate goes up little pupils get big hands get a little sweaty, don't want to admit it. Nobody wants to say they're scared. But you know, when you answer a cold call, it's a mistake. And you're a little bit afraid of what's going to happen. So we want to turn that fear, the trust. The fear is the springboard. The trust is where you're trying to get the energy going forward. And it works most of the time. Gotta learn to do it, though. It's not easy.

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So you just said, answering the cold calls a mistake

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on the user? Right? No,

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I get that. Yeah, but that's interesting way to put it. They already know that. Everybody thinks

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it's a mistake. So they'll do it on their phone or dammit. Gotcha. Yeah. Yeah. They don't like the position. They're in you. Think of it this way and the environment of evolution. We live in villages. People from the village across the river show up in the night. They're invisible and they're strangers who don't like them. Good. Yeah, they're not bringing us a Bud Light. They're they're coming in to change the demographics of our bill.

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Build suddenly and violent, like people that we don't know, in the dark. When you call somebody,

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you're in the dark. They can't see you.

25:11

Yeah. Are you? Have you studied a lot of this psychology? It sounds like you have on the

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on like a case study kind of level, right? But, you know, this gets into tribalism, this gets into grouping, all those kinds of things, are you it's a very visceral reaction you're playing into. I mean, yeah, tactical empathy is very, that said that right? Is that was, yeah, that's the FBI. Well, it reminds me of the pickup artists remember that guy? Right? You ever heard that guy? Yeah. You're like, Well, we took a couple of things from Hey, I mean, it's like it's, it's, you know, psychologically intended to say manipulating, but you know, it's just kind of knowing what's possible. And what, you know, he's playing the vulnerability. I think the whole strategy was to call girl out on something she she has, say something nice, that's kind of backhanded in the middle of it. But be like, your hair looks, you know, that's kind of a weird haircut, and then just kind of turn turn your shoulder or something. And it plays because it plays into vulnerability and insecurity of women out at a bar looking for men.

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It opens up a conversation, but also it's a numbers game to him. He has no soul. So he doesn't care. Right.

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I feel like sales calls. You know, I was just telling Eric right before we got on air. Have you seen the telemarketers on HBO yet? No, I haven't. I didn't even know that was the thing that sounds interesting. spoke very highly of it. It's a great documentary. He said it might be the best documentary he's ever seen. Yeah, it could be recency but I do trust it. I you know, I have friends that I don't trust their movie opinions. You know, you're like, okay, but so they kind of fell into it. This, this kid, like oh seven, who's 14, he dropped out of school had to get a job. And he got it in this telemarketing place. And he started uploading videos to YouTube. So they, they have all this footage from back in the day. And it's about the scam of like,

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the Fraternal Order of Police donations they were doing. I don't know if you've heard of that scam at all. But it's pretty gross.

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And they

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replayed on me. I didn't buy it. But you didn't want the sticker to get out the door to get out of a ticket. That never happens because they're not affiliated with it. Yeah.

27:35

I just get the ticket. Yeah, brother said. What?

27:40

Yeah, and the psychology is everything sales as b2b sales is different from b2c sales. So you're selling to consumers said they're risking their money, selling to businesses, that person is risking their career. It's a bigger deal than their money, the risk and the reputation, the risk merityre future. And the easy thing to do is nothing, which is why I'm b2b. Almost all sales pursuits, and and nothing. No decision. Everybody thinks that's because, well, you know, nobody was good enough. But that's not the issue. The issue is the buyers got to trust one of the sellers more than they trust themselves.

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Because they're not the expert. You're the expert, you're the seller. So now you've got to exceed their own trust threshold. If they think that they know enough to say no, they're gonna say no, because they don't ever think they know enough to say Yes, right? It's easy to say no. So it's a b2b is is much, much harder to sell than B to C. He just sees a simple risk. It's your it's your money. And maybe if you're buying something that's going to be sort of show you off socially, you know, clothes, a hat, whatever, you know, then you might be a little concerned about that. But hey, if people laugh at you once, at least you can put that sucker aside. You don't have to wear it right. But you can't put aside the

29:00

Neverwhere who lots again.

29:03

Oh, yeah, I won't tell you what I gotta

29:06

I guarantee it's not as bad as what we're wearing over here.

29:10

It's still pretty hot over here in Florida.

29:14

You know, we're on the marketing side, mostly of things. And I think I don't want to speak for Eric, but I think we always kind of thought it's weird that sales and marketing are kind of separated.

29:25

They point fingers at each other kind of thing to us, I think maybe because maybe we're more on the digital side coming into a lot of this kind of business Theory and Practice Management and stuff.

29:38

Well, I just feel like it's all it's all should be one cohesive thing and not separated groups.

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What the sales, marketing conflict, what do you have? What can you kind of what kind of wisdom can you tell us about that? Well, I got a measurement that is interesting. So we measure the pipeline that

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built out of conversations. And the way we do it is our customers, let our technology access their Salesforce system or whatever. And we analyze their opportunities just to ask a simple question, which is it somebody from your company have a conversation with somebody from their company before that particular deal? Because after all, they're using our technology that tons of conversations, right, so we met at back. And then we tell you how many dollars of pipeline at what stage of the process those deals are in. And here's what we thought, we thought just like everybody else, hey, you know, everything comes out of meetings and sales, you talk to somebody, you set a meeting, you hold the meeting, go forward, you know, and you do demos, blah, blah, blah, and you get to a deal. What we found is that two thirds of all the business that comes from cold calling has nothing to do with meetings. It has to do with marketing. You talk to somebody, they go to your website. And why do you buy Google ads? Why do you set up SEO? Why do you do digital marketing at all to be found? You want them to come to you? And then your CTA call to action actually appeals to them and they take an action, right? Well, how do you get them to the website, it turns out sales and marketing converge inside the humble, cold call. Because in almost every case, that person is going to do two things. One is they're going to go to your website. Secondly, they're going to answer that email that you send them that says, Thank you for our conversation today, which is the easiest email in the world to send and get open. And you you exit the world of spam through the door of the relationship and the cold call. So they come together, right, their marketing, people don't know it, because they don't listen to cold calls. salespeople don't know it, because they're myopic, and they're just trying to turn them into it.

31:50

They're the they're tapping knees and rolling calls. It's

31:55

Yeah, it's interesting. It's omni channel integrated marketing. And it's different for every every business is strategy, right?

32:03

I always use the buy car scenario, right? I go, I use this more for an offline online kind of thing. But it it's applicable to this. It's like, it's on average, it's 25 touch points, to buy a car, right? And some of that's subconscious hitting you there's ads in the paper that you throw away, but you might see it real quick, or you might get those emails, it kind of warms it up in your head a little bit. So 19 of them are digital, and six, on average, are offline. But they have to work together to close the sale. Because the the linear method of the touch points is different every time. Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, what we've discovered is, I don't know why this is surprising. When you start with a relationship building inside the other person's midbrain, inside their old brain, and you start with trust, everything else flows easily digitally. Digital gets cheap, and effective. Digital is always cheap, unless you're paying Google. But it's not always effective. You got to have a lot of numbers out there, you gotta put a lot of stuff out, it's hard to target. Who are you targeting? Well, you think you know who you're targeting? And then you find out maybe you're not quite targeting? Right, right. So imagine, not instead, but as an adjunct, like the first approach to a market, you say, well, some subset of these people I can get on the phone? What is that subset? About? 37%? Okay, how about if I talk to them, learn what it is that they would love to see what we're offering. And by the way, the ones that don't want to take a meeting, because only five to 8%, will take a meeting. I mean, the most brilliant cold callers in the world get up around 30%. But these people are geniuses, and most of them five day percents pretty good. What about the 95 92%?

33:50

Where are they going? Well, you didn't really lose them. You had a conversation with them. They know your voice. They've heard your company's name. They've forgotten a lot of it. But that's all right. But they probably went to your website while you're talking to them. We actually are measuring this now call it forward. So we're working with a company called signals.ai out of Utah. And we've analyzed our own company and just ask this question. They don't. We're not very happy with our website. But it seems to produce about a third of our business. We don't pay Google a dime. Google told us this one's by the way ahead of advertising. Google once said to me, you know, you're our vendor of the year. And it bothers us that you've never paid us any money.

34:32

You're like the only company in Silicon Valley that's never paid to Google tax. I said, Well, we just talked to people. Right? That's what we do. Well, we didn't get us. We just talked to people. And we're doing what a Google AdWords, right?

34:47

Yeah, you're with the human diet. Not even not even that it's even more effective because you're reaching out it's a push versus pull, right? You're waiting for people to find with intent. That's their deal, right? They have to get

35:00

intent of the user, whereas you're going out in, in finding that user, before, they may know they go to look something up with intent, right? So you're kind of cutting them off before they even get to that part, which is even better to your big problem in b2b. So all salesman is whatever it is you're selling, they already have solved that problem. They're just solving it in a way that you think you can help them solve a better. I mean, nobody buys stuff to solve a problem they don't have. And if they have a problem, they've been solving the problem. The question is, can you help them solve it in a new way. So brand new stuff never really sells? I mean, that's what Geoffrey Moore wrote about Crossing the Chasm. You can only sell that to certain kinds of freaky people, a regular people and regular businesses buy to solve a problem they've already solved, it's better. And they'll only do it about once every three years, for any product category for any problem category. So you got a one quarter period for them to consider buying, you got three years as the replacement cycle. So that means that 1112 So your market is not in market right now of your perfect market, your 100% Mark, in that market. So what are you going to do about it? Well, classically, we say, let marketing nurture them. But how do you do that competitively? How do you How is your content your nurturing program? So much better than everybody else's, that you win? When they come around? Again? What's simple talk to them once a quarter? The only ones you're gonna get to talk to her the ones who answered the phone? Thank God wants to answer the phone, you know that the answer the phone,

36:36

call them again. So we have a whole program built into connect. And so where you just set it and forget it, you say, Hey, I talked to Mary. Mary said, not good timing, don't take a meeting, you know, go into the Riviera, whatever. Okay, I just stick a date out there, quarter out and say, little teleprompter. Hey, Mary, when we spoke back on the 19th of September, you said you were heading to the Riviera hope it was a great trip is now a better time to talk. Suddenly, you're a genius, because you're doing marketing, that long term nurture. And you're doing it with the human voice, which carries 20,000 bits a second of emotional information. And that changes the whole game. So the whole idea, the reason I got this podcast, the market dominance guys podcast is if you do it right with the human voice, it's not the cold calling that makes it work. It's the follow up. And it's not regular follow up because you do all the digital stuff. It's magic follow up, you're inside their head. Yeah, it's somebody, once they're talking to you, you might not even have a relationship with them. But subconsciously, they think they do. They're totally obsessed with you. Because it's familiar, right? And it goes back to what you were saying at the beginning, where everybody in self preservation mode, you get past that, then you can follow up follow up. Oh, I kind of know this person. I have a relationship with this person that helped me except you don't know him at all. Yeah, that's interesting. This is a similar really interesting stuff. I think we got to go out on that note, you're you might have to make some phone calls.

38:08

I gotta, I gotta, I gotta record a couple episodes of market dominance. Well, if you ever need some scanning, Scab guest to be on your podcast, we're gonna ask all the dumb question. Yeah. Need some dumb guy? No, this is this is great stuff. Guys. I love your questions. I love your whole thing. You know this. It's a fascinating world we live in when you think about it, right? The innovation economy we totally depend on, we're not sitting in caves, eating bugs, almost everything we do. We're getting out of some Unchi companies working together to make stuff happen. That's the world we live in. It's kind of made by innovation turning into products. We're talking to each other now through the most complex set of things that have ever been done. There must be 100,000 products between you and me right now that are making stuff happen. And we depend on it for our lives now. And yet, the entire innovation economy is bottleneck on that first relationship, somebody has a solution needs to be trusted by somebody as a problem so that they can actually look at the solution. And that's why we're in business. That's what we're all about is pulling the cork out of the innovation economy. So some value can flow because that's what we all need. We all need those innovations to go to market. And by the way, most of them are pretty good. And most of them fail because they don't go to market.

39:26

You got a Jedi kind of mastery of talking about this. It's it's very interesting. I appreciate you coming on and dispensing this wisdom. We didn't even get to the I wanted to talk to you about the bottleneck stuff. We'll have to have you on again. Because it's I do believe the bottleneck starts above the sales funnel as well. Where do you have right above the top? Yeah.

39:48

You guys want you too much fun? All right. Oh, we didn't we made like what? 70% Less crass jokes. This time we run our best be Yeah. And I even offered that my ass hitched right? Yeah,

40:00

The Tesla S roasting problem. What was it? An allergy to electricity? That was good prolapsed anus car. That's all. Thanks a lot, Elon. Thanks. Yeah. Yeah, we know each other better now. All right. Thanks for coming on.

40:16

All right, thanks so much, guys.